Jason Redman's Comeback Story

00:00:10 Speaker 1: All right, Welcome back, everybody. We're here for another episode of Comeback Stories, and today's guest is Jason Redman. So. Jason's a retired Navy seal in a New York Times bestselling author of The Trident, Overcome and Point Man Planner. Jason uses his twenty one year Navy seal career to relate how the mindset practices for decades to lead, build elite teams, and deal with the highest levels of adversity can transform your life in business. Jason teaches how his overcome mindset helped him rise above leadership, failure, vicious enemy ambush, life changing injuries, and even a debilitating business crisis. Jason's incredible story, positive message, and vibrant energy make him a highly demanded speaker both nationally and internationally. Jason, it is an honor to have you here with us today. Brother. Welcome, Don, Darren, thanks for having me on man, both of you guys. So, sir, yeah, I can. I can relate to the comeback Oh yeah, no doubt. So tell us a little bit what growing up for you was like. You know, it's nothing crazy. Um, you know, I didn't grow up in a hard or bad place and I'm probably a little more normal, um for this day and age. My parents divorced when I was young, UM, and when that occurred, I think both of them. My dad lost his business and we ended up moving my and my dad won custody of myself and my sister, which was a little strange at that time, but uh, you know, still bounce back and forth between my mom and dad, and just you know, that was kind of my life, bouncing between the two of them. UM, So moved around a lot. Always had to appreciation for the military. My dad served in the military. Both grandfather served in the military during World War Two. My grandfather on my dad's side, he was a highly decorated BE twenty four pilot. So originally when I was younger, I was like, that's what I want to do. I want to be a pilot. But later I learned about special operations and started to want to go down that path. But I was not I probably wasn't the typical kid that they would normally look for. I was not an athlete or anything when I was really young. I didn't start playing sports until probably fourteen or fifteen. I just I was kind of a late bloomer. I was also the runt. You know, I was literally the ninety five pound weekly, and you know, I had these aspirations to be a special operations guy, but nobody believed I'd ever be able to do it. So I just said, well, you know what, if I'm gonna do this, one I got to start working out, and two I should go do some hard team effort things. So went out for the football team against my dad's wishes. My dad said, don't You're not gonna play football, and I said, yeah, I am. So went out for the football team and basically was tackling dummy, but loved it. I've always loved football, and then started wrestling also, which taught me a lot. Wrestling is a great sport to really forge a good mindset and teach you how to condition both your body and your mind, uh you know, against an opponent. And it also taught me how to take an ass kicking because I actually wrestled in the same weight class as our state champion, and boy, he used to throttle me on a regular basis. Sounds like you learned a lot of humility. Yeah, yeah, learned how to take an ass kicking. So can you can you think about like an early memory of pain as you were walking us through your childhood and think that sticks sticks with you about, you know, a struggle or just something that really was tough back then. I remember. I remember one day at football practice in my in my junior year. So in my stphomore year, I went out for the football team and we were at a really small, tiny high school and that team it probably wasn't that big a deal. You know, I knew most of the people there, but our city consolidated high school. So my junior year I went to this bigger high school and I wanted to play football, and obviously there it was a bigger team, and definitely there were a lot of guys on that team. It's probably some of the first times I really encountered, Hey, if you're not part of the in crowd, then guess what, We're not only not gonna like you, we're going to try and drive you out of this crowd. And I experienced that a lot on the on the football field at practice. Hey what's this little tiny runt doing? You know, you don't belong here. So when they couldn't get me to quit, then it kind of turned into we're just gonna try and beat your ass on a regular basis, and interestingly enough for me, that just kind of fueled this bigger inner fire. But I'll never forget. We had a practice one day and I played receiver and I played a cornerback and I was playing corner and they were going over a new play with the offense and I kept thwarting that play, kept getting the blitz over and over and over again, and it was really starting to tick guys off. And it turned into I remember, I'll never forget. They were getting ready to snap and the center was like kill Redmond on three and that was the snap, and like all those dudes came after me, and I remember walking off the field like, you know, bruised and battered. But I was like, you know what, I'm not quit. I will not quit, and I'll never forget. Man. The assistant coach came up to me, his guy by the name of Walt Lockleyer came up to me and said, you know what, man, he said, you may not have the skills, he said, but you got more heart than almost any guy on this field. He said, don't ever lose that. So you know, I never went on to be a great football player, but I definitely remember that moment. There was a hard moment, you know, definitely there were guys who didn't care for me, but it was a moment that I also managed to overcome. Where would you credit that? I guess it's a mindset, but it's also a heart set, Like where how did you tap into that? How are you able to get that? Like? Where do you think that's rooted in? So I think some of it has definitely got to be a little bit genetic. I mean, you know, we often talk about that in the steel teams. What makes a Navy seal? And I really think that there there are two critical components that make a seal. One is we have the ability to endure more pain and discomfort than the average individual, And in some ways I'd say that at the higher levels of athletics it's like that also, uh And the second component also probably common and higher athletics, we have the ability to process formation faster than the average person. So you can you can be in a very chaotic, crazy environment, even a very dangerous environment, and you're you're able to make very quick decisions. So as at a at a young age, what can I credit that to? Um? Like I said, I didn't grow up in some crazy, dangerous environment, grew up into a relatively normal family. I think some of it was just genetic and some of it was just I was always kind of the run. I was a smaller guy, not a big guy. Now you know, I'm I've eight one seventy and I've always had to stand up for myself and make a place in this world. And sometimes that came at a cost. But no matter what, it never deterred me from backing down. I credit it to my success. Out of anything I've ever had in my life. I think that to nasty and that willingness to keep driving forward regardless of what people thought, regardless of what people said no to me is merely a word that says there's another path to get to where I'm going. And that's all that that means. And I talked to a lot of people about that when we talk about the overcome mindset. Who would you say was one of your best, first real or best teachers out there? You know, I got to give some credit to probably I would say my wrestling coach. He is actually a former Army He was a former Army infantry guy, and I think a Special Forces guy but you know, when you're younger, sometimes you make those things up in your mind, you know. But he definitely, I thought, did a very good job of shaping our team, our wrestling team, and forging us, introducing me to hard workouts and the hard things and pushing myself and from there, I'll be honest, I mean, if we get deeper into my career and I write off and about this individual, I mean, the single person who influenced me the most throughout my military career, my entire leadership philosophy is built on this individual was a seal who was a legend and the seal team is probably one of the best leaders we ever had. And he just a legendary career and lost his leg in a in a accident below in the Amptee. Back before it was common for the military to hang on to individuals like that. Back then, it was like, oh, if you're an amputee, you're gone. You know, we're not going to keep you. And he fought, and thankfully so other people fought for him to stay in the military, and he went on to have a phenomenal career, served at some of the highest levels, and he stayed my career on several occasions and really truly showed me what leadership at the absolute highest levels are. You know, I man, I'm maybe twenty percent of the leader that guy was. He was hands down the best leader I've ever seen in my entire life. And like I said in in my book to try to ann Overcome, I write about many of the things that he did. Jason, I want to talk a little bit more about your journey to the Navy. First. I know he talked about from high school, from wrestling in football practice. How did you end up getting to the Navy. I know you said you wanted to be in special Forces, but were there things that happened after after high school before you went to the Navy or was that an immediate decision that you made. No, it was an immediate decision and kind of an interesting decision, once again, an opportunity to overcome. When I started going, I was probably fifteen when I decided to want to become a seale. Probably fourteen, but fifteen. My dad's office wasn't far from the recruiting station, and I would pop in there. I'd be like, Hey, what's up, guys, you don't want to be a Navy seal? And and I'll never forget there was an old crusty in the navy they called boatsman's mates. Boatsman's mate was like the original sailor. Sailor. These were the dudes who you know. They they worked the ropes and the lines on a ship, the anchors, I mean they they they were the guys who make the ships go from all the way back in the beginning of the navy. And this guy was like the crusty old boats AND's mate first class. And I walked in there and he told me, beat it, you're never gonna you don't able what it takes to be a steel. Don't come in here. And I'd come back and he chased me out, and finally I got tired of that, and the Army was like, hey, man, if you don't want to be you know, if they're not going to help you to be a steel, come join the army. We'll let you become a Green Beret and a ranger. And I was like, okay, well that, you know, that'd be almost as cool. I'd rather be a steal, but if you're not going to support me. So when I went to do that, I actually failed the airborne physical when I went up to the screening and they were like, well, you can do something else. You could drive trucks, you could do something different. And I was like, no, I came in to do this, So I left. And I knew that I could jump and dive, or I knew that I could die if I had done that when I was in the Virgin Islands. So I told h you know, I got a doctor to write me a waiver, went back to the Army to present it. And at that time, the old the old recruiter, the old krusty first class, had left and there was a new recruiter there, a guy by the name of Henry Horne. And Henry was like, hey, man, I heard you wanted to be a steal. You know you still want to do that. And I was like yeah, I said, here's my you know, here's my waiver letter that basically says I'm good to go. And Henry helped me to get into the Navy and become a steal. So yeah, man, I tell everybody, no, exhaust all your resources, because if I had just listened to those initial challenges and problems, you know, I wouldn't be a steal today. So and but then Darren, Yes, he answer that question through that unique journey. I enlisted in the Navy on September eleven, nineteen ninety two, while I was a senior in high school, and as soon as I graduated, I actually headed off to boot camp. Wow, that's two days before I was born. If that gives any content, so well, Rod to that, man, that's awesome. I feel like nobody would be able to, especially somebody like you, to be able to have a twenty one year career in the Navy and be as decorated as you are wouldn't be possible without some growing pains and tough lessons learned early on. What were some of those lessons and experiences as you had early on in the Navy. Ah, Man, you know, and Darren, you're going to relate a lot to this. I grew up in a pretty religious home, didn't do a whole lot of partying, and I came into the Navy and the military and especially special operations. We work hard and we play hard, and in a peacetime military, I think there's a pretty strong emphasis on the work hard. As a matter of fact, right, wrong or indifferent. Sometimes you are judged by your ability to play hard, and I definitely went down that road as a young, impressionable young man and really bought into that scene. I mean I burned it down. I burned the candle at all ends with teammates and friends. I mean, it was not uncommon my very first deployment, we deployed to Panama, and down in Panama, it was not uncommon for me and my roommate to be out till four am in the morning and to come back and still be hammered and show up for PT and go do you know, a ten mile run and work out, you know, and just sweat all this alcohol out of our systems and then go work all day, go back to our room, sleep for a couple of hours, and then we'd go out and do it all over again. And definitely not good for you, but it's you know, it was fun. The downside of that. As my career started to progress and I started to move up into different leadership positions, you can't not I don't tell people that you can't party and have a good time, but you have to pick and choose when you do it, because credibility is everything as a young leader. And as we move up and we start to get I became arrogant and uh and I see this a lot in athletes, um, which is pretty easy to do. I mean, you, if you are a high level athlete, you're on this project, this trajectory path where you know you're you're thrust into the spotlight at a young age, you know, in college, and then suddenly you move into professional sports where you're making money. You're in the spotlight, and it's easy to start thinking you are the man. Uh and and the seal teams are not a whole lot different. You suddenly are part of one of the most elite special operations forces on the planet. Um and and I started to make mistakes. I started to party a little too hard. I started to uh do things that were damaging my credibility as a leader. Yeah. No, I can relate one hundred percent. There was definitely m arrogance that development in my addiction. UM being able to uh, you know, do drugs and party and still be able to perform at a high enough level in college and early uh into my NFL career. You know, there was an invincibility that began to develop, and it was like, you know, these things can't happen to me. There's no way I could fall like I got this far I can, you know. But as far as uh maintaining and continuing to grow as a man and as a leader, those things never really uh crossed my mind. So when do you think that, um, that that switch clicked for you, um to to change and to uh except whatever maturation looked like. So for me, it still took quite a few years. You know, I was I was doing well enough and and and dared. I'll tell you the difference in and my career that probably kept me from totally burning out was in the Navy, you're not allowed to do drugs. You know, we run the risk of not that well. Either way, I stayed away from that. I was smart enough to at least stay away from that and continue to excel, so moving up into different leadership positions and then to get selected for a commissioning program. And about that time I also met my my my wife, So I ended up getting married and I ended up going to school for about three years while I was getting my degree. And that probably stopped a lot of my party. And although it didn't stop my ego and arrogance, my ego when arrogance continued to climb because I was doing well. I was kicking ass. I mean I got to school and I was smart enough to do very well in college. I mean, once you know, it's funny. Once you figure out how to study and you have a decent work ethic, college really isn't that hard. You do the assignments, you study, and you know. And so I got good grades. I moved up in the leadership positions within the college ROTC unit, and by the time we left there, I had managed to move up into the number one leadership is that position for that battalion, and also ranked number one when I came back for my commissioning as an April officer. So I was just kind of stacking wins, which is good. But the downside of that is I was thinking, man, look at me. I'm like, God's gift a leadership. I'm going to come back to the Seal teams and I'm gonna be like, I don't know, George Washington or Patners something that you know, It's probably what I believed in my mind. So when you talk about the fall, when that occurred, I came back into my first platoon as a young Steel officer, and several things had happened Number one. Nine to eleven happened while I was at school, so I had served in a peacetime military where you could probably get away with a lot more partying back then, because granted, we weren't sending guys off to war day in and day out. So I think the leadership, you know, kind of probably was like, Hey, we're training these guys at a high level and they don't really have an outlet, so we're gonna let you get away with a little more. When the war happened, suddenly overnight, the shift had to happen, and because it became very real, and not only that, the steal teams learned that a lot of our older tactics warfare typically is based off the last time you had sustained combat. For the US Milly and the leading up to nine to eleven, the last time they had seen sustained combat was Vietnam. So when we went to war, when the military went to war, they quickly realized, especially special Operations and the seal teams, and I think quite a few of the other ground forces realized that those old tactics based on jungle warfare and some of the things they did back in the sixties and seventies did not work, and they especially did not work in a mountainous urban desert environment. So there was a rewrite of all our tactics that occurred very quickly within the first two years of the war. So when I came back as a young officer, all of this had changed. I guess it'd be kind of the equivalent of you're at one team and you go to another team and suddenly they hand you an entirely different playbook and scheme that you're trying to learn, and instead of humbling yourself and being like, hey man, I have no clue how to do this, and reaching out to the older guys or the more experienced guys, going hey man, can you I don't understand how this you know wildcat works? Can you teach it to me? As a leader, I was too proud and too arrogant to say that. I was like, man, I'm a prioristic guy. I'm the man like I know, and even though I didn't know how to do some things, I was too proud to humble myself. So what was happening. I was making mistakes, and on top of making mistakes, instead of owning it and say man, I got to figure this out. I started drinking more, and I went back to the bottle and really started drowning myself at night in my starros and alienating guys, pushing guys away, you know, because saying nobody, yeah, you know, nobody can appreciate this. They don't understand, and I don't want to tell them because I'm the leader. I can't tell them. I can't show weakness, even though I was showing weakness all over the place. So all of that culminated with It was about almost a two year fall where I was just slowly shipping away at my credibility as a leader. I was slowly getting earning a reputation as a drunk. I was earning a reputation as a poor leader. And all of it culminated when we went into Afghanistan. I made a bad call on a mission. Didn't have anything to do with drinking. I wasn't drinking over there. It was just a It was a call driven by arrogance. I wanted to get in the fight, and I put myself into a position where I could potentially get in the fight. I am very fortunate that that decision didn't lead to anyone being killed. But I tell you it killed my professional reputation. And that was the fall because there were guys who when that occurred, were like, kick that dude out, get rid of him. He's dangerous, he's going to get somebody killed. I've heard you mentioned in this story or just part of your story, about credibility, and you know, when you've lost that credibility, how you build it back. And I've heard you say one day at a time, and that really resonates Darren and I come from the rooms of recovery, which it's that same that same concept, and you were talking about stacking wins and we talk about stacking days. Um, so I just really resonate. I resonate a lot with your message and the victim mindset and all of these things that you're kind of weaving in right here. So um yeah, if you can touch more on that, but I think you kind of nailed it with the credibility thing, Yeah, Donnie, absolutely, And and and it's hard, I will tell you. I mean it's it's when I tell people overcoming is a difficult thing, as it should be. I mean, you're dealing with something hard, You're dealing with adversity and it's even harder if it's because of a failure that's occurred in your life of your own making. And I watch a lot of people, first off, they don't known it, and that's one of the biggest things. You got to own your mistakes. And that took a little while for me. And when yeah, so I guess, you know, if we were to say rock bottom, that really wasn't rock bottom. Rock bottom was. I got sent back to meet with my commanding officer. I almost killed myself in Afghanistan because I was so distraught at the thought that I had failed as a leader and that I was potentially getting myself kicked out of the seal teams that I literally put a gun in my mouth and was getting ready to take my life. And thankfully, you know, the big Man above and my family I had pictures on the table stopped me from doing that. And I meet so many people that do this also. We convince ourselves that it is the end when we don't even know all the information yet we don't know what the outcome is going to be. We make up the end in our minds. We automatically assume, oh, my wife's gonna lead me because I did this terrible thing, or my teammates hate me because this happened. Or you know, my co workers are never going to talk to me again because this happened. That may or may not be true, but allow them to make those decisions. Don't make them for them. You know, you an overcome mindset says I've got to drive forward down this path to figure out what's next. So that was kind of the first step. That was the right step and seeking help, and then from there it probably took a few months of starting to understand how to rebuild myself. There were several things that occurred. One, I had a leader who believed in me, and that's a really big thing. I mean, finding someone who believes in you. This is why finding a coach or accountability partner when you're coming back off something hard, when you're trying to overcome a failure, whatever it is, I mean, someone who believes in you is a really big deal. Because my credibility, my confidence was shaken here. I was a super arrogant guy, and all of a sudden I question my own abilities to be an effective leader, to be an effective seal. And my commanding officer there in Afghanistan said, hey, red. You're you're a good leader, I've seen it. He said, you're just arrogant. We need to humble you, and we need to put some things in place for you to learn. And there are several things he did. One of those things was he sent me to US Army Ranger School. And a lot of people don't know that Ranger School, at its heart and soul, is a leadership school. It's a two month school based in adversity where everyone in that school rotates through different leadership positions and you're graded on your ability to lead within Ranger School. And it was at Ranger School that I kind of finally started to grow up and that maturation I think we were talking about, you know, finally maturing and coming to understand, you know that I was the problem, that it was me. I had put myself there, Donnie. You talk about that victim mindset. For the first probably three or four months up until I got to Ranger School, I saw myself as the victim. I saw, oh, they you know, they're just jealous and they just don't like me. And you know, whatever excuses we can make up in our mind when something happened so that we don't have to take the blame. And it was finally when I was at Ranger School that I that I came to grips with hey, man, like, you're the problem. You're drinking, your poor leadership decisions, you being selfish, all these different things. I was the problem. So the good news about when you figure out you're the problem, you're also the solution. And it was there that I started to figure out, well, okay, you. I started looking at who are the good leaders. I talked about that amazing leader who helped save my career. I looked at him, I looked at other leaders, and I said, well, how do I I want to be like that? And it wasn't going to happen overnight. This is where it really does become one day at a time, and sometimes you'll make great progress only to be knocked down again because you, I don't know, you come across some situation. You know you. For me, I made it through Rangers School and did very well. At Ranger School, was ranked very high. My peers said, this is a good guy. The instructor said, I was a good guy, and it was a great win for me. But when I went back to the seal teams, the guys were not happy to see me because I was still They called me Rambo Red that was my nickname. That is not a compliment. And the Seal Teams, that's a that's a a knock. You were built on the military and Special Operations is built on team and three hundred and sixty degrees of influence and protection. So if any one person is only focused on themselves, like Rambo, that's very dangerous to the team. So they were not happy that Rambo Read had come back. And I kind of had to start over when I got back to the Seal Teams, and I just took it one day at a time. You said, you're that was your rock bottom. It was nothing either September two thousand and seven or anything that happened after that. And we'd obviously love to hear your hearer story around that. But it's interesting that that's your rock bottom and nothing from the circumstances that happened on that day or after. Yeah, it's funny a lot of people want to bring that up that you know, I mean a big part of my story is getting all shot up in that gunfight several years later. And but I'll be honest, and this is something that I talked to a lot of people about when you are going through hard times, it sucks. We all live in our own personal health and man, sometimes in those long dark nights, it's easy and dangerous to get inside our heads. This is the most dangerous battlefield you'll ever walk across, and it'll convince you that you'll never come back. It'll convince you that everyone hates you. It'll convince you that you'll never be able to do whatever. I don't know what you did before, and I definitely had nights like that. But going through that and getting to the other side and showing that you can be better once again, you may not get back to where you were before. That is one thing that I talk to people about. An overcome mindset doesn't guarantee that you're going to get back to the same level you were at before. Sometimes, unfortunately, with whatever's happened in our lives, we may have destroyed that other path. So instead we have to figure out what's our new path, and that becomes a whole new journey. Also. You know, for me, I wanted to get back to be a seal operator and a seal leader, and thankfully I was able to do that. But it was through that long hard path, step by step, day by day, you know, one positive evolution, one positive combat mission, things like that that built back my credibility. And that's what really builds a strong overcome mindset. It's the hard times. It's grinding through the adversity. So I tell people, when you have something miserable that's happened in your life, yes it sucks, but also that's what builds an overcome mindset. You cannot magically flip a button and say, oh, I'm going to overcome when something hard comes along. The human mind and body, your emotions don't work that way. If you have not been forged in the fire, at least at a little level, you will you will crumble and burn and just burn up when something bad happens. So when I was injured, when I was all shot up in this gunfight, you know, over two and a half years later, I will admit, probably in the first week land in that hospital bed, I was struggling and I had a lot of the thoughts that all of us have. You know, this isn't fair, you know I did. I thought that several times. So here I was. I had come back from this crazy journey and built myself back as a leader, only to get myself all shot up and be told your military career, you know, maybe coming to an end. But I told myself, hey man, that's the hardest road you've ever walked dig getting yourself out of that leadership failure hole. So this journey is no different. We take it one day at a time, we take it one surgery at a time. We try and be positive, and we try and lift others up. And you know, the formula for leadership is the same whether it's on the battlefield, whether it's on a football field, whether it's in a boardroom, or whether it's in a hospital bed. The formula for leaderships the same. It's positivity, it's setting the example, it's setting a goal, going after that goal, accomplishing that goal, and then continuing down that path. And that's what I said. So I'll tell you that my leadership failure in the journey through it set me up for success with my battlefield injuries. Can you talk about just the extent of your injuries, but then also follow that up with I know you have your three rules of leadership, which I love and I know the audience would love to hear that also. Yeah, So I was my team and I were going after a senior level Al Qaida leader for the western province of Iraq, pretty dangerous individual, and we walked into a very well executed ambush by him and his team. I was shot up by a machine gun between my body and body armor. I was stitched. I took multiple rounds across my body armor. I took two rounds in my left elbow, which I thought shot my arm off in the firefight. I took rounds off my right body armor plate. I took rounds off my gun, rounds off my helmet. Um soum so rounds off my helmet. I had my left night vision goggles shot right off my face. And when I when I moved back, realizing I was in a really bad situation, I actually caught a round in the face that hit me right in front of the ear, traveled through my face, exited the right side of my nose, blew out my right cheek bone, broke the bones what was left in my cheek bone broke and kicked out to the right, vaporized my orbital floor. It broke all the bones above my eye. My eye fell into this newfound hole. Um it broke the head of my job on. It shattered my jaw to my chin. Um. So when I got to the hospital, um, I you know, I was facing the prospect of I had no use of my hand. The doctors told me my elbow was effectively destroyed. Um they were. They told me I had massive nerve damage, so they were talking about amputating my left arm. Um. Obviously my face was massively Um, the whole right side of my face was destroyed. And I was I was wired shut, I was trigged, I was being fed through a stomach tube and uh. And they were telling me it was going to take years to put me back together. So it Uh, it was a daunting Um, it's a daunting road that I was looking down. But once again, like I said, that the hardship that it had and before And this is why I tell people, man, if you can successfully navigate through hard situations and get to the other side, even if it's not where you wanted to be. I mean, Darren, you know you have an amazing comeback story because you got to come back and you're playing in the NFL. They are equally as many people out there that you know stories like mine, and they didn't get to come back. I mean me too. Well, that's not true. I never got to operate in the seal teams, but after I was wounded, but I got to operate. After I failed as a leader, I got to fix that. But what I tell people is, oftentimes when there's a d ND moment and you're going through that, overcome that journey, that new beginning sometimes becomes even better. You just you know, it's not something that we're looking for. Sometimes it finds us, and if you're willing to embrace it, it's amazing what you can do with it. I mean, I never thought i'd be I never thought i'd be doing this. I'll tell you that when I was younger, I never thought I'd ever write a book or being a speaker or any of this stuff. You know, that was never a thought I'd ever entered my mind. I thought, you know, I was going to do thirty years as as a Navy seal and I don't know, you know, on a d on land in Montana or something. Well, well, we appreciate you painting the picture of what that time in your life looked like. And I feel like one of the biggest lessons I feel like You've definitely learned in Donnie and I have learned it's not so much about what our circumstances are what happens to us, but it's about what we do about it in response. And I heard you say once the greatest gift that we have is a choice. And you know you had a choice to make when um, you you were being operated on. Uh if I found them it was a letter I believe that you put on the door outside of the room that you were in. And could you explain that to people? And could you also expound upon um how dangerous self pity can be in a situation like that. Yeah, one hundred percent. So thank you for bringing that up. I mean, is it is amazing because I think we're living in a day and age right now where we're feeding this victim mindset. There are a lot of people that want to build buy into this idea that they are a victim and that they can't do it on their own, that someone else must save them. So it's causing people to get this idea of well why even try because you know, race, creed, color, gender, demographic, religious affiliation. You know, I don't care what it is. I mean, you name them off right now. There are a lot of people that are buying into well, I'm a victim, and I don't believe in that. I believe that. Not only do I not believe in that, there's millions of stories that disprove that across the board, because there are so many incredible successful people that come from all walks of life, race, creed, color, gender, you name it, who have done incredible things because they chose to overcome and so layd in that hospital bed. For me, it would have been easy to have felt sorry for myself. And I was struggling with that in the beginning, and I had had some people that came into the room and they were talking about military hospital is a really hard place to be during a time of war. I don't know if any of you guys have ever been to one, If you went to any of the hospitals during the war, any height of a war, the wounded awards are just they're hard to see. Battlefield injuries are very traumatic injuries. They are gunshot wounds, blast injuries, burns, amputations, traumatic brain injuries. And you know, literally the halls are filled with these young men and it's all it's all young men and women the majority of that time that you're seeing. So these individuals in my room were pretty overwhelmed by that, and they were talking about what a shame and what a pity that we send these young men and women off the war and they're never going to be the same and all that, and they left and I remember like sitting in that bed and was just like, man like, is that me? Is that who I'm going to be? But that comes down to that defining moment that I said no, because you have a choice. That's the greatest gift you have in this life, no matter no matter how many times you're told no, if you are willing to put in the work. It's not a guarantee. It's not a guarantee of success. I can tell you that right now. But you absolutely are choosing never to succeed if you just sit there and buy into someone telling you know or you're not going to make it. And so many people accept that, they just go with the victim mindset. Well, I just can't make it because of X, Y, and Z, And that could have been me in that hospital room, but I didn't. And part of that goes back to the lessons I had learned before that path that I had walked prior. So I chose to drive forward. And I told my wife when she came back in the room, I said, that's that's never gonna happen again. I said, I refuse to feel sorry for myself from this point forward. And it was really a good moment for me because it kind of knocked me forward to say nothing but relentless positivity and forward momentum from this point. And I'm not going to allow anybody else to come in this room and express pity for me because I won't. I won't feel sorry for myself. And we and I wrote out that sign and it said, attention to all who enter here. If you're coming in this room with sadness or sorrow, don't bother the wounds I received. I gotten a job that I love, doing it for people that I love, defending the freedom of a country that I deeply love. I will make a full recovery. What it's full. That's the absolute utmost physically, i'd the ability to recover, and that we'll pushed that about twenty percent further through sheer mental tenacity. This room, you're about to enter his room of fun, Optimism, an intense rapid regrowth. If you're not prepared for that, go elsewhere. And UH we signed it, hit the management and UH put it on a bright piece of reddish orange poster board and it went up on the door. A steal teammate of mind took his U tried it off and put it into the bottom of the door a few days later, and it ended up going viral. And it's just it's been seen and placed on doors now by millions of people, which is pretty amazing. Man. That's that's incredible. Man. I wish we had like another hour to continue to go in, especially to the next part of your journey from from the hospital room to speaking to creating your leadership programs and protocols. And I feel like we got to definitely have you back for a part two, man, because there's there's so much more to your story that is to continuing to be on older than we want to highlight that as well. Man. So I'm so grateful that you had time for us today to come on here and share and be vulnerable and be real about every part of your story. So i'd just say thank you. They're my honor, man. Thank you. I mean, I love saying hey, fellow overcomers. So you know, people need that we're living in living in a hard times, and I mean people need to know anybody can overcome. Yeah, Jason. I also I also want to acknowledge you first, thank you for your service. But you know, Darren and I have always had this dream of at one point doing a live event, like a Comeback Stories live event, and I kind of feel like, other than Darren and I, you're kind of the poster boy man because your comeback is just so epic. And Darren, you're right like we've barely probably scratched the surface because we've heard your story, but you have so much wisdom, like you know, the the three rules of leadership and just all these little nuggets that I know the audience could really use. I've heard some of these tools, and I'm like, this is like straight fire, especially from a leadership standpoint, because we're all leaders in one way or the other. So yeah, if you're down, or if you're ever in Vegas, So Darren's sitting, I'm working, I'm virtually right now. Darren's in our podcast studio at the Wind Hotel in Vegas. If you're ever in Vegas, we can do it. Live and do the next one in person, or maybe we can just have you back for round two. Man, I'd love to. I get to Vegas several times a year, obviously, there's a lot of conferences that occur in Vegas, and I'm actually I'm actually coming out there for a trip. I can for some personal reasons that I might have some extra time in May, So let's let's make it happen. It would be an honor to meet you in the flesh, no doubt. Yeah. Likewise, yeah, i'd love that man. Get to work out in and and uh so, yes, sir, Yeah, thank you for everything. Thank you for everything you're doing, and keep carrying the message man to come back the overcome. I mean, it's like we're basically our podcast. Everything you're doing, it's the same message. Um, your adversity and everything that you've overcome is so inspired. I'm just sitting here and all right now. Oh, thank you guys, and dude, count me in in a second. For any live event you ever do, I would be I'd be there. So we're gonna make a notice. Absolutely, yeah, we we we we put it out there to the universe, so we're gonna make it happen for sure. Okay, thank you. People need it, So thank you guys for what you guys are doing. And yeah, kudos to both of you overcoming what you've done. I know, I know how hard it is man to to to get deep into the dark recesses of our mind where the demons live and tell, and they're telling you'll never do this bother, you know, just have another drink, just go store to line, you know, just no one's ever going to take you back. I mean, I've walked that path. So kudos to you guys for not only overcoming it, but now as one of my quotes, you know, being a light in the darkness because there's a lot of darkness out there now, no doubt. Thank you so much, Jason. So yeah, thank you guys. See you bro. All right, we're out. What's up? Comeback stories, family, It's Donnie dropping in here. So did you know that Darren and E's relationships started by me being his personal development, mindfulness and mindset coach. I want to let you know about both my one on one coaching program, The Shift and my group Mastermind Elevate your Purpose. These coaching programs are specifically designed for people who are ready to take the next step in their purpose and level up their career, personal finances, and have more connected, deep and meaningful relationships. My gift and part of my purpose is to help others take that next step and leveling up their lives so that they can have a great or impact on the lives of others. Creates success that sustainable yet evolves and grows, and help build a legacy that will outlive your life. If this is calling you, just go to Donnie Starkins dot com and apply for either one of my programs.