Plant or Pivot

00:00:04 Speaker 1: Comeback Stories is a production I've Inflectioned Network and iHeart Radio. Welcome back everyone for another episode of Comeback Stories. I'm one of your co hosts, Darren Waller. I'm joined by my guy, my friend Donnie Starkin is Donny. How you doing man, I'm doing well. Man. It's good to be here again. Good to see your face as always always brother. I'm super excited for the guests we have on today. You know me, I love to create music, just listen to music, just the overall energy, anything that has to do with music. And we have an artist on today who is really seeing the fruits of his labor. It really start to come to fruition. A lot of the listeners may know him as putting out an infectious single called Billie Eilish, but a man who has so much good work in his catalog and is really still just warming up. I love to welcome our Money White to the show. Our Money welcome, bro. Thank you, Thank you, Bro, thank you for having me. I appreciate you, yes, sir, man, appreciate you creating time for us. What you went up to lately? Man? What's going on in your life these days? Man? I'm ducking from the sun even, you know, like I take as much as you know, the time that I can when I'm home and just like sit down, work on some music, like be a human, play a video game and something like that, because like you know, like it's I only get like two days after week to be home. Tomorrow we've headed out for another festival and then I think after that we run in New York, Montreal back to that la. So it's just it, it's not start running. I feel you, bro. I'm definitely gonna die in with you on how you stay human because I think some of the same problems myself. But I'd love to just dive right into your story and start about growing up for you and what was growing up for you, like where was it at and just paint a picture for the people. Yeah. No, I think I think we were the last kids like that were outside. You know what I'm saying that we was like the we like our generation was like the turning point of the internet kind of taking over people's lives. So like my like, you know, we spent our last couple of days just like being outside, like you know, getting in the only time I wasn't outside, I was on punishment and like those moments when I was on punishment was where I kind of learned how to work then, and that work my space work Facebook and Tumbler or whatever it was at the time. So but yeah, I mean for the most part, we was just I was just, you know, just just a little the little bad kid in the neighborhoods. Just couldn't stay out of trouble. And like everybody knew my parents, so anytime I did something, they told my parents and I just get back, right right back punishment. I feel you, man. So you grew up in Philly, right, there's a lot of u There's a lot of different images of Philly. You got like fresh Prince of bel Air, Will Smith getting out of West Philly and still represent You got meek Mill, you got a little ouzy and people paying a side of Philly that's tough, but they all love and have a sense of pride about it, and I believe you do as well. What it makes it so tough? But what do you love about it? Yeah, I mean that's what it is. It's like the fact that it's so tough and the fact that we came up in this city it kind of gives us that that sense of pride to say, like, you know, if you can make it out of here, you can make it anywhere. Even if you can make it and stay in here, you can make it anywhere. Like just because it's a very uninviting city, Like if I could, if I can describe it in any way that if you're not from here, it's like, all right, what were you doing here? You know? That's that's kind of the mentality, the personality that just like the city has for you. But but once you you know, once you're kind of getting gray seed and into the culture, like it's a dope city, there's always something some way to be a part of something, you know, just something going on in Philly. There's always something. Is there any distinct memories of of pain that you look back on early growing up as a kid that may have affected you in a way or affected the way that you just looked at the world or approached life. Well, to be to be all of be honest, as much as much pride as I have for Philly, it's being from Philly. There was a big piece of my life that I had to just step away from Philadelphia, like because of all the trauma that I experienced in Philly, like you know, just just growing up being outside, like all the trouble that we got into. But also in two thousand and six, there was a house fire when I was staying with my aunt. I was like back and forth between my aunt's house and my mom's house, and there was a house fire that my aunt had where she lost her life and my three cousins lost their lives. And from that experience on, it was like really hard for me to just be in Philly. One top of just a few other things like like like a few a few years following that, my uncle, her brother, he was shot and killed, and and the row rage incident. It was a lot of just trauma, like just a lot of trauma that I think that I experienced in the city growing up, and some things that like it's kind of like a hungry dogs keep running kind of thing where like you you don't even really get the process some of this when it's going on. You just kind of like, especially for me as a kid, I didn't I didn't understand the concept of like, you know, my cousin who was my best friend at the time, like I'll never see her again, my aunt, who was my second mother at the time, I never see her again. Like you kind of just have to keep growing, keep learning, keep running, keep like experiencing things, and you don't really get a second to kind of step back and just look around and say like, oh, this is what happened, and this is how I'm affected by this. You know, like a lot of that, a lot of those things I took with me. I didn't realize how much of a shift it created in my life until I was, you know, maybe like like reaching like twenty twenty one years old, and I'm starting to just like peel back the layers and say, oh, this was actually happening. You know. I read a quote from you that said, a lot of us in Philadelphia, when you just talk to someone, you feel like there's a lot of trauma, a lot of pain. There's just a lot of layers to that city that we've all gone through, and if we haven't gone through it, it's it's the trauma has been passed down, right, and we find ways to make our trauma sound and feel and look beautiful, but at the end of the day, it's still trauma. When I read that, I was like, wow, because I'm watching someone like you that's transmuting that trauma, transmuting that pain into a greater purpose. And in fact, that's why all three of us are sitting here today with our own past and our own pains. But yeah, I always say, like people were all the same. We all have pain, and we're all just trying to find freedom from that pain. And a lot of people like myself and Darren back in the day, would numb that pain through drugs and alcohol. Other other people will hide in their work and get busy, some will close their hearts, and then there's other people that find that greater purpose. So yeah, yeah, I just found that fascinating, and that awareness that trauma is passed down and sometimes we don't even realize it even if we haven't had it. It's that ancestral, that deep stuff that's just generational dysfunction more than anything. Yeah, no, absolutely, I think I tried, at at the very earliest, I tried to just kind of understand the through lines of I guess, like how trauma and how like pain affected people and when they resorted to things, like you said, like drugs and alcohol. In my head, if I wasn't doing drugs and alcohol, then I was not like I wasn't taking my trauma out and in a toxic way. I was handling it in a healthy way because I didn't go resort to drugs and alcohol. But I think my downfall was I used to take that trauma out on other people and my relationships, and like you know, like when I said, like you know, we used to go outside and just try and like I don't know, I was wanted to be the bad kid. I wanted to be the tough guy in the neighborhood. But it was all because I had this feeling of misunderstanding that like I felt like nobody could understand who I was, what I was going through, what pain I felt, and so I had to inflict that pain on other people. But it didn't even process to me how toxic that was because I wasn't doing drugs or alcohol. I was, you know, even even in the moments when I was involved in the distribution of these things. That was like I didn't even think into the process of like, Okay, if this is not me doing it per se, then I can't be affected by this. I can't be actually dealing with anything. It was just, you know, it was almost like you said, there's just kind of like we we we all are just living in a world of trauma, and we're so like deeply tied and connected to the trauma that it just seems natural to us. It's not saying hurt people. Hurt people, and if we don't, if we don't heal our own wounds, then you know we're we're we're sure to inflict it and and bleed on other people, if you will, If coming from somebody, maybe Darren, you can maybe I speaking for both of us, but I can't. I would never understand how you didn't tap into to drug and alcohol abuse just based on the trauma and the pain, because I don't believe. I mean, we all have pain, even though my pain might look different than yours, but just hearing your story and everything that you went through, I don't feel like mine was on a level of yours. Yet I still went down that road. So how did you steer clear of drugs and alcohol? I did? I will say I drank alcohol until I was fifteen, and it wasn't it wasn't never anything related to pain. It was like I just thought it was cool because everybody else is doing it, and it was like, you know, you see all everybody would come back to school like yo, I was, we got drunk and we did such as so I had you know, I used to try and do it and it just tasted awful to me. And I remember one time I did it in California one of my cousin's house and I blacked out, woke up like didn't remember anything, and I was like, yeah, I don't. I don't like that feeling like I'm not I'm not really not really on that one. And as far as like just drug related drugs and itself was so it was so embedded into my culture growing up, you know, like my my father, my father played a hand and distribution to drugs, a lot of other family members, a lot of friends, a lot of people in the neighborhood. Like I've seen how drugs that kind of just derailed the course of people's lives so much that I've always just kind of just been you know, what's the world of like tunnel visioned on this idea that I want to be a success story, I want to be a musician, I want to be someone great. And I was like, I feel like, if I you know, if I ever let my trauma, let let my pain put me in this pocket where I start to kind of abuse drugs, then I may be taking away from the larger picture, the bigger goal. And I was you know, that was just always the thing that was hanging over me. That was like kind of keeping me in the right direction. That level of focus from a young man is impressive to me, especially with all the things that are swirling around on the outside of you and on the inside of you, with the violence and you know, navigating the pools of drugs and alcohol and everything else is going on in Philly. Where does your music passion coming to the picture? When did that begin? How did that begin to sprout? Honestly, like, music was always music was my before me. It was my aunts and uncles, my grandfather, like everyone everyone in my family played music, played some sort of an instrument. So it just kind of became a thing that uh, you know, it just became a thing that was passed down from me. By the time I got to it, I was in the choir. My mom had me in the choir early on. So uh, you know, after after after I realized I was like maybe I don't got the best singing voice, I started, you know, just started messing around with the ideas of like just I will watch all all the rat videos, like you know, run back from school, so I could turn on BT one of six and parking watch all the rat videos, and like that just became a thing where I was like, yeah, I feel like I could do this. I feel like this is something that I you know, I I could excel and I could be like really good at telling my story whatever the story was at the time. You know, I was like second and third grade. My story wasn't that impressive. But like you know, over time it just developed into like from a hobby to a I was trying to get all of my friends around me. I was like, y'all write your raps. I'll write your raps. I'll write your reps, like, you know, just trying to get everybody to be a rapper with you. So it wasn't just me, and and then it just developed more and more into, you know, just into a real life thing. It was like and for a while, honestly, like as as the as the street culture, like the neighborhood culture and music blended, you know, you're talking about like the Little Wayne era, like the mixtape era, Like like everybody at that point was rapping, you know, like like my member, my homie Keeam, his mom bought us a microphone and we were just sitting in his room and just like you know, we take turns, one person to press record and the other person in press record. And that was my earliest memories of like, oh no, we could actually do this, we could actually make songs, We could actually you know, turn these an MP through reason and download them onto our phones and show people. But it was always the thing that was embedded in my lifespan. You know. Can you take us through any moments that may have almost detoured you from wanting to pursue your passion? Was there any disappointments along the way from before from when you started to when you started to get on, like where you may have wanted to give up or people were telling you that this wasn't the route, like at there any moments like that your story, absolutely, I mean you got understand like I'm I've been rapping since I've been rapping since I want to say, in second grade, I've been trying to put words together. So by the time in fifth grade, sixth grade, that was when I was like, yo, I can actually take this serious. At that point. I remember it was a moment where we thought we was gonna get signed the State Property and Rockefeller. You know, we're kids, and we're like, yeah, we're gonna be the next one is like, you know, there was there was so many of these versions. I had to you know, I had to go through the experience because I wasn't like the cool rapper that was just rapping about drugs and guns and like a bunch of guns in the videos, a bunch of money, a bunch of girls in the videos. I had to go through the experience of like just being the quote unquote rapper and trying to explain to everybody that I'm a rapper and nobody actually cares. And you know, by this point, you graduate high school, you graduate, you know, and everybody else got it is in college, got a job, and you're just like, nah, nah, I'm a rap, trust me, it's gonna work out, like you know, And that was a you know, that was that was a real like awakening moment. For a while, I was just sleeping in my car in a garage, you know what I mean, Like I was sleeping in my car in a garage behind a movie theater and that happened. I want to say, ad that went on for about like two months. Yeah, I think there was a lot of There was a lot of these moments that just played and played out for a long period of time until until that that you finally get that breakthrough. And for now now it's like a conversation on the internet where it's like, yo, it's overnight success, and I'm like, overnight success took you know what I'm saying. It sounds like you've you've always no matter what, we're gonna fight for this dream and this vision of rap stardom, Like where does that Where does that juice and where does that fire come from? When I was a kid, my dad didn't let me quit anything, And I think that's a big route of like where a lot of it started from. It was like, yo, like it don't matter if he put me in some sports that I never wanted to be. And I remember I did karate for like a year and a half just because I could not quit. My dad wouldn't let me quit anything. I couldn't get up front the front of the dinner table until I ate like eighty five percent of the plate. Like it was just like there was no quitting in the household. So at that point, even when it got like really really tough, it was like like you know, when I decided, Okay, I'm not going to do anything sports related, I'm not going to do anything, you know, like anything I don't know, college related, so forth, it was like I was so far down this path. It's like if I quit at this point, like I didn't shot myself on a point for literally anything else in life that I want to do, it's like I can't. You know, I can't. I can't turn back to the clock and and you know, go back to high school and you know, like I didn't. I didn't. I skipped so many big milestones in my life too dedicated towards this thing that it was almost like Yeo, it has to happen. I don't know how, I don't know in what way, but it has to happen. And that was you know, like it was just something I fought for for too long for me to give up on it. That lesson that your dad shared is like people not really understanding that fully in twenty twenty three, like when things get uncomfortable, people want to go to something that is easier or like that's not going to have them in fear or in doubt when really like that character quality of you. No. I read this quote that was like my friends Asiana boys at it, and it was, what's the point of having faith if you're gonna lose it when you need it most? And that's like my favorite quote right now. That's my favorite quote right now. It's like, what's the point if by the time when you actually need faith to kick in anybody to have faith when it's easy, when you actually need faith to kicking you just get rid of it. What's the point of having it at all? You know? Well, I just posted a story on Instagram yesterday about that where I believe faith relieves us from the burden of excessive responsibility. Like whatever your faith is, faith in God, higher power, universe, like and my and my beliefs, are you better believe in something bigger and badder than you because like when things do get tough and when things get too heavy, like who are you going to give it up to? How are you going to really be able to trust trust the process and trust that life is always happening for us and not to us. And even some of the things that you went through. You know, it's like there's lessons there. I'm thinking back to the lessons that your dad taught you, and even the lesson of I heard the story of your dad getting you, getting you the bike and you were getting bullied and your dad said, whatever, do whatever it takes to bring that bike home. And it's almost like that lesson, right there is another one of those don't quit lessons where no matter what happened, you always always brought your bike home exactly exactly, and that's that's that's always. That was just my dad. That was my dad, and any like any and everything. It was like I don't care. I remember. I remember when he had me in boxing, I had this far against somebody was like two times my sizes, Like well, look this is what you asked for, Like I don't you know. I'm like, yeah, you sure, it's nobody else in the gym. He's like, nah, listen, the person you're looking for was right there. And that was always, you know, that was it just kind of gave it gave me that like fighter spirit, that fighter mentality, because that was that was exactly who he was. And he only wanted to train, you know, Like when I was a pup. He only wanted to raise raised like you know, pitbulls, bulldogs. That was like actually going to go in there and fight for whatever it was that you want it, And don't matter if you wanted to be a chef, he was gonna fight for that. You know that that that food plate. You want to be a trash man, he was gonna fight for that trash can whatever it is. Like you know, so, so when did when did you start to reap the harvest of that faith that you just told us about. Honestly, the journey is never it's never just a linear path. And you know, I'm pretty sure everybody can attest that it's never a linear path. My first like the first moment when I really started to reap. But I remember I was in college. We had dropped a song called stick Up when I said, like we had no money. I was in college. I had I had just bought a we bought a try iPod to make the camera steady, one of my homies cameras, and and like it was, you know, it was just like yo, I had called like ten homies, like yo, you stand right here, you standing right here, You're standing right here. You walk behind the camera, man, make sure he doesn't fall. And then we just shot this video on my friend's block and the video went like like it was like, you know, whatever the version of viral was in twenty fifteen, it was like it popped up on YouTube, popped up on Tumblr, it went crazy on SoundCloud, et cetera, et cetera. And at that point, that's when I first started getting like phone calls from the labels, phone calls from the different companies managers and everything. And then it started to feel real. It's like, oh, I'm getting interviews, like people are asking me who I am. That was the start of something bubbling. That was the first moment where I felt like I can actually do this, this thing, this thing I've been telling people that I'm gonna be one day, It's like it's not as far as I thought it was. I remember we went on we had got the call to go on tour that fall with a Big Crip. It's like, yeah, we're gonna go on tour for a couple of days. And the first night we're like we're like I think seventeen eighteen years old and Big Cred is like thirty five. I don't know, Like his audience is way older than I am. And I know the first night we went out there, we like hight jumping around my DJ. He throws water in the crowd, misses the entire crowd gets it all over the equipment. They kicked this off to over the first night, and I'm just like, wow, this is a quiet car ride home back to Philly, Like oh man, that was sawty and you know, and and but we still had this like we was riding on the high, ride on the high. And then that following year, I got the phone call that my father I had just we had a show in Philly, and I was like, let me just go andvite my daddy and him. It was like we weren't on the best terms. And then we gonnavite him to the show, just like let bygones be bygones. And when I pulled up, that was when I found out that he had cancer and he was going through chemo. It was like really but like you know, and like in its terminal stages of like you know, he's only a month or two left to live. And I just remember remember that that like crashing halting moment where like everything just stopped. We get so so like I explained it to you, Like that was the first moment where I I remember that I was real if that makes sense, Like I like, I've been so lost in this journey of I'm gonna be a rapper one day, I'm gonna be a star, I'm gonna be at this or that. That was the first moment where it like it pulled me out of that world and it said, wait, this is I'm actually still just ARMANI. I'm Lee's son, I'm Donna's son, I'm this kid who grew up around here, and these things are happening in the real world that's actually affecting me. And this like I can't write a song that's going to fix this. I can't, like you know, yeah, Like like that was so I took. I took a step back just from everything music related. I took a step back from everything music related. In twenty sixteen, it just like I wrote, I wrote it out with him until he passed that June, and honestly after that just took a break from music and Philly and like all together. I moved out to UH. I moved out to LA. Moved out to LA for a couple of years from the end of twenty sixteen. Up until I want to say, like the end of twenty eighteen, I was just, uh I I just couldn't like it was like a I don't know, a demon on my back kind of thing. Anytime I came back to Philly, it was this idea that was like just it's something that was haunting me, that just didn't allow me to be in the city and feel good and feel comfortable until you know, I finally came back twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen, it was like, you know, like let me just kind of face my fears and and and staying on top of whatever it is that's like haunting me right now. And you know, and from there, I think from there on was where things started to kind of there's honestly, it's just again it's just these these like it's never a linear path. Because I came back to Philly and everything was going good. The pandemic happened, and we had a house fire later a house fire in twenty twenty and just when I'm thinking everything is cool, this house fire happens and they charged us for arson for the house fire. And it wasn't like, you know, like there was there was no no intentional house fire. Nothing. It was literally like the fire got called a fire, called something called fire, and we called them. We called nine on one and whatever whatever they got to taken care of nothing, no real damage, nobody hurt, but they charged us for arson. And this is like pandemic times. It's like we don't know if we're ever getting out of jail. We don't know, like they you know, they're not giving nobody bails, Like it's just so we got warrants out. We like I'm literally like in my mom's living room, like anytime somebody rings the doorbell, I'm terrified. I'm like I would know who that might be. Like it was, it was bad for like a month. We're just trying to figure short lawyers. Like I'm like, I can't get pulled over. I get pulled over, they gonna find it. Like it's like, you know, we're trying to figure this out for like a month, and we finally just had to we had to turn ourselves in go to jail. And I'm you know, and I'm just thinking about it from the perspective of like if I go to jail and like, you know, I've built this like clean image for so long that like everyone just disappears. Everyone's like, you know, how fickle this these these entertainment industries are. It's like, you know, like you can nobody ever takes an account that you're a human sometimes makes mistakes or things happen, like it's just like, ah, you got a bad strike against your name. I don't really want to, you know, so I'm just thinking about all of this, Like everything I've built for all of these years, it's just gone from one, you know, some somebody putting in a warrant out for me that doesn't even make sense to have, you know, And so we went through that, We went through that moment, finally made it. We made it out of the jail. And a year later we went to trial or pre trout for it and they threw our case out. And now it was like I've been it'd been greener pastures ever since. Like that was like the moment where I finally like just you know, started the sore because at that moment I really was like, you know, we made a project called Things We Lost in the Fire, and it was really just like about taking that moment and the house fire had as a kid, and just making a piece of music like almost like a journal entry, that guy that just kind of talks about the things that I've been running from for the past ten years, past fifteen years, and just really get it off my tests, really speak about it, really just be vocal, be open, honest and vulnerable about it, and get past that moment so I can just get back to making making fun music, having fun with music, enjoying myself with the things that I'm creating. And that was right after that, that was the Billy Eilish moment. That was thee walked into that Billy Eili's era. It's crazy how in order for you to get to the moment of you know, where everything takes off and everything starts to get good, it's like it feels like, yeah, there's a sense of it doesn't seem like I can escape this pain. It doesn't seem like I can escape bad things happening to me. Like you talk about being real and you can't escape the pains of life as a human being. But for you, it's just like if it feel like an avalanche, like it's just like it won't stop. Like did you feel like that, you know what? It feels like, I'm gonna make make make a football refers. It's almost like I felt like anything good, anytime something good happened, you just kind of had to plant your feet. You had to plant your feet, lean forward. You was like, yo, just kind of breech yourself for the impact because something I don't know what it is, but something bad is around the corner, like and you know, like even and we've been I've been dealing with it a lot more amicably and just like a lot and a lot healthier of the way because it's a slower process. But like we I was fighting, fighting, fighting to just get this project out, just like you know, this Rodocasta Blanco EP just out of the way so I can start working on the album. And the moment we finally do, I'm like, wow, I can finally who's breathe? I got the tour dates is done. Like I'm good. I can sit back for a second, relax. I get a call while we're on the press run, I get a call from my uncle that says, yeah, you know, we just we just found out that Grandpa l has terminal lung cancer and you know, they're giving them a few months or like up to a few months left. And I'm just like god damn. Like I it's like, at what point does it, like the good not come with the bad. That's where I say, it's like when when these things happen, when you get these really high highs, like I just plant my feet at this point, I'm like, all right, I don't know what it is. I don't know where it's going to come from, but I know at some point, like there's something that if I'm if my feet aren't planning, it can knock me over, you know, if I'm not embraced, if I'm not ready for it. I'm not ready for that embraced if I'm not ready for that impact, and they can knock me over. If we go back to I just wanted to circle back about the conversations around your dad. What did you learn about death and maybe grief the process of death, and then also maybe what you how you could have handled it better and what you learned in the process of actually processing the loss of your father my dad. For a lot of people who have their father in their lives, their dad is like the strongest person, like as it is your kid. You know, you you kind of idolize and view your dad is like the strongest man the word he's Superman, and watching my dad have cancer, it broke a lot of spells, and like there were good spells and bad spells that I learned from him. And it was just like this idea of fearlessness, this idea of bravery, which he instilled in me. But I think I learned bravery in ways that weren't all that weren't actually braving. But I mean by that, it's like, in those moments of weakness, he showed be bravery from a different perspective that it was okay to cry, it was okay to lean on someone, it was okay to have help, and it was okay to have family. And that was a new level of bravery that I learned just dealing with his transitioning and when he ultimately transitioned, because you know, like dealing with something like the house fire in two thousand and six, I went down a dark path because I didn't know how to channel that energy, that energy, I didn't know how to process it, and I didn't know how to express it. And one of the you know, one of the rawest things I could have did when my father passed was just cry, you know, And it's like and it sounds crazy, like because because you know, like everybody you know like has that emotion. But for me, it was just like that was a hurdle just to be able to cry, just to be able to let that like let that expression out, and and dealing with like dealing with losing him. I just I got really really comfortable with just the idea of crying, like being okay with crying, being okay with being expressive, being okay with like not like not having a calculated response, but just having a raw emotional response when it comes to me the people I love and the things I love and how it's affecting me, you know. And then that was that was a real that was a really really really sharp learning curve for me. What did what did grief teach you? Did you ever go to grief therapy or counseling or get outside help through this process? Yeah? We were like so again I think I did like I did grief grief counseling, and there was a level of therapy. There was a version of therapy that did not that long ago, but even you know, and even just talking to doctors and talking to therapists like having like just like you know, free conversation. A lot of it would I always get back is like a lot of this is in you. And and for me, what people would tell me that you're just an open book. You're an open mind, and you're just like an open thinker. Like as long as you're able to put yourself in an environment where you can think all these things through and think all these things out loud, then it's not so much of like the external help that you really need. It's just like you being comfortable with like speaking it out loud. You know that that that was for me that you know, I'm not speaking for everyone, but for me, that was what was most helpful. Grief counseling. When I did it was like I want to say, seventh grade, there was so much that was going on, Like seventh eighth grade. There was there was the house fire I had. There was like a my sister's boyfriend he had just got shot. There was we had a friend. I had a friend in Kwair who had just got killed. And just like and there was like that that was something know like that was really like a I don't know. It was a weird thing for me because he was playing football. We was just he was a practice and like I think, you know, somebody was tackling him and it's their foot kicked him in the head too hard or something, and he, you know, like the trauma killed him on impact. And you know, even for that was weird for us. It was like he just died doing something that he loved. He didn't do anything wrong. You didn't do any you know, but it was in that moment. It was in that phase of my life where it was like, you know, you just gotta pick it up and keep going. Whatever it is that you dealing with, you just gotta pick it up and keep going, pick it up and keep going. So much so that like all of that unrolled and like this this the processing of like external pain just taking it out on everybody else. When when when I did grief counsel and I'm not sure, I'm not sure if I even listened. You know, I was a kid, you know, I was a kid. I was just kind of like, all right, yeah, like this person is saying things to me, and I don't you know, maybe it makes sense or maybe it doesn't. I don't know, but honestly, i'm you know, sometimes I might even just be like I'm I'm very hard hitted. Sometimes it might even just be a process of like me being a slow learner in a sense of like I'm just being at a contrarian like, you know, just being like just just being in a contrarian to whatever it is you're saying, even if you are making sense, and in like three or four years down the line, when I don't have you and I realized I need you, I'm going to remember everything you said and it's going to make sense and it's going to steer me in the right direction. And I think a lot of which because when I turned it off, when I turned off that I want to be a hood kid, I want to be the street dude whatever. When I turned it off, I turned it off. I have no interest in it, Like it doesn't excite me. I'm not you know, like it's not even the yeah, I want to buy all these guns for protection or whatever. It's like, I turned it off like it was done. And so I think, but I think a lot of it was because I had these small, small seeds planet throughout the process that didn't really like they didn't grow, they didn't sprout until years down the line. But when they sprouted, they finally like you know, like when a moment like my father passing happened, all those things that didn't make since then made since now. That's that's a beautiful realization to come to man. And I look how you talked about you felt like you had to dig your heels in right now that you're seeing a lot of your dreams come into fruition, there's abundance of blessings coming into your life. Do you still feel like you gotta dig your heels in even though things are going great? Or have you escaped that mindset or you're still trying to find your way out? Like how are you dealing with that now? I mean even when my grandpa, my grandpa was that was recent, that was real recent. So like it's it's a little bit of it. It's a little bit of a dig and my heels in. But I don't know, like like it's like I try not to I try not to like be so so invested on this idea that something bad is about to happen, because you know it might, it might, it might stifle you and like create a cloud of all the good things that's happening. I just I kind of focused on, like, Okay, what's in front of you right now. What can I like, there's a there's actually a quote that I've seen and like it's like an old, old episode of Oprah. I think when my mom watching it as a kid. But it was this guy was selling a book and I don't I don't know why this one moment stuck with me, but this guy was selling a book and he said in this book it was it was a quote that said, you're only in control of two things in life. It's how you prepare for what's about to happen and how you react it with just happen. And so like a piece of me is always digging my feet in and saying, Okay, I'm prepared for whatever it's about to happen, whether it's good or bad. But at the same time, I'm reacting to all the good that is happening because it's it's just a lot of good. You know, that's beautiful. Man. What are your what are your practices today as far as being able to stay in the present and not time travel or future trip too much or go back to the past, Like, what are the practices you're doing today to keep you there, to keep you present? I think you know like what I learned a lot from especially when my father passed, and is uh how important family is. Family is quantified like you don't you know, you don't get another mom, you don't get another dad, you don't get like a lot of these things. So it's, uh, it's just like I value that. It's so much now value like the importance of family. Like what I now, you know, with these with this new found career, with this money whatever it is, like what I now can do for these people because I don't you know, like for me, I'm so you know, just setting focused, laser focused on what the goal is that like I don't even think about, you know, if this person is dealing and struggling with this bill and this is something that I can easily help with. That literally does not it doesn't changed my trajectory. It doesn't hurt me, like I literally wouldn't even you know, I wouldn't even realize if you took it from me. Like I'm like, but that one little thing I can do could change somebody's entire day. I just try to do that as much as I can for the people that's like that's around me, and I try to find little ways, little pockets to stay human, Like I'm at the end end of the day, I'm just like a real big kid at heart, So like I might just I might just ignore my phone for the whole day and watch dragonball Z like I might, you know, like just little things that like make me still feel like in my raw's essence, I'm the kid that didn't you know that that that just did everything that he wanted to do and didn't like conform to whatever everybody wanted me to be. I think staying human is so important, man, because we see so many people rappers, athletes, like when they reach a certain level of success, it's like it leaves. It's like the humility may may leave, like just the passion for creation or whatever their craft was may leave. And it's like we change almost And it's like, how do we continue to achieve all of our goals and our visions that we have set out for ourselves, but don't change in the process, continue to still be ourselves, continue to grow and change in the ways that we need to change, but just foundationally who we are. We don't change in that way though, And that's it's beautiful to hear you say that. No, No, I think I think it's it's just important as far as it's like like you just said, be like just humility, being a human being, like being present in this because what you gotta like what I understood and learn to understand is like like this this idea of the entertainment world is so like it's it's all about the side, honestly, like like the success, the trajectory, the longevity of it. It's like, yo, did you buy this Chaine? Did you get this car? But like you know, there's there's pages that that can can count up how much your outfit is worth. There's like there's all about the beside so much soda. It's like you don't really get the chance. Like nobody's talking about the good somebody did nobody, you know, there's no there's no trophy for you know, for waking up one time and taking care of somebody I don't know, Like like so a lot of times I might I might pay for the car behind me a chick for like nobody nobody hears about this, Like you know what I'm saying is but these it's all the little things that just make you feel human, make you feel real. If you just went to the park, them like throw a frisbee around if I just you know, if I just sat outside, I put my feet in the water, Like these these little things that like we completely throw throw away sometimes because getting the chain is cooler, or like you know, like I need I need forty girls to pull up with me at this section of the club for I don't know. It's like, like none of these things really exciting me that much. Darren and I talk a lot about finding your center, right, I think we all have a center. We all get pulled off our center from the world's demand for the attention of our minds and YouTube specifically if we're talking us three, because of the platforms you have. You know, I know you mentioned that you'll often pay for maybe a family member's bill. But I think there's a balance between also setting boundaries where there's a lot of people wanting certain things from you. So where do you find that balance? Like what are you doing to protect your your mental health and your energy these days? And do you have practices like meditation or any movement practices that actually bring you back to your center? Yeah, I go, I go to the gym. It's like that's like my meditation, that's that's my you know, and Dan tell me, tell me if if I'm if I'm just making this up on my head. But there's like a certain level of I feel like I like, for me, it's on a bench. If I'm bench present and I'm small, dude, I'm like one seventy, but like I can bench two twenty five now like two twenty five couple of times. But that that that idea of the weight of the world on me and I just pick it up and put it off of me. It's like I feel like I can accomplish anything, you know what I'm saying. And so that's like that's my real you know, that's that's like my real hyperbolic time chamber where I can gotta go in and just like and be at peace, b centered, be training, like be focused. But at the same time, when it comes to you know, like the demands what I what I realized that family and people other like who aren't in this world 't understand. There's like there may be a day where thirty thousand dollars comes in and at the same time that that that day that thirty thousand came in, it gets broken down like say it's for a show, that show got let's show amount got broken down to like maybe eight thousand dollars, and at the same time, just in other expenses, I spent about another I don't know, twenty thousand, and like, yo, we had to set this up for the sprinter, we had to set that up for security, we had to set that up, so like you know, like thirty thousand might have became I don't know, like negative twelve thousand. Like I went on tour for two months. I went on tour for two months, and I'm made twenty five thousand, and we spend about sixty just staying a flute, you know, and so like. But the people who don't, who aren't in this world, don't understand that concept. So I don't know. Somebody asks me the money, I'm broke holding out on that as long as I can, I'm like, yeah, I'm broke. I'm super broke. No. I can relate to both of those examples, especially like in the weight room. It's, uh, there's something that that's trained in your mind when there's like something providing resistance to you and you're able to push through it and overcome it, like it translates into your character. It translates into your everyday life. When you make that a habit of your life, experience that becomes your character becomes it gives you the strength to put your heels in the ground, like when it's when it's healthy too, and when you and when you have no other choice and anything difficult that comes there's, like you said, just trying to stay afloat or things aren't where exactly where you want them to be. I push through because I don't quit. And there's also the family side and and and the money. It's like, you know, you gotta be willing to have that courage to say like this, this isn't what it is like, I love you and in ways that I can, I'm gonna bless you. But yeah, it's like people see my name go across the bottom of screen. It was like, uh, three years fifty one million. It's like that's really just an extension. And it's like they put fluff on the contract, like yeah, I'm really only making twelve this year and then I'm out in New York now, so it's taxes on that. So it would be like six like my account right then and there tax free. Like but a lot of people don't yeh, yeah, don't understand that that's you see and yours is fifty one. Mines is like I think I don't know what that number is and other people's is, but like mines was was. I think it was like six million total or something like that. It's like, I mean, like and people think that six million line is like, oh, you have six million dollars, Like nah, I got like a couple hundred thousand, And it's like that was that was before, like you said, before taxes, and then I took care of this. I had to take care of that. Then I had, like you know, like it was things that we were still taking care of on top of just like now my image is a lot higher. I have to pay for it, you know, like I have to look the part a little bit. Either get a chain or get they just get little things that like that just make me look like a rapper now, and like just the living expenses on top of it. I'm like, you have no idea how much money I don't have as opposed to whatever that number was you've just seen on that press release. Like cause you guys both well Armandy you were talking about resistance or Darren you were too with the working out, but I was curious. We've had a previous guest on named Stephen Pressfield who wrote the book The War of Art, and the whole book is about resistance and how resistance gets in the way of our creativity. So for both of you, because you guys both write music, how do you deal with resistance when it shows up as like writer's block or you know, wanting to put pen to paper and you're just like not coming up with anything. It's like, for me, what I learned, for the most part when I'm having writer's block is really just a a lack of experience. That's for the most part, And like sometimes it's maybe something different, but a lot of times it's like I don't know what to write about in this environment or with this particular song because I'm not living it. I have to sometimes a lot of times I have to just go outside, you know, I have to go outside and like breathe air, Like especially if like I'm writing a record that's like relatives, I want people to enjoy themselves, have fun. I have to go outside, have fun and just like and you know, and just because nowadays when we're writing music, we're not writing something that's abstract art anymore. We're writing something that's relative to people. Were writing something that's the soundtrack to people's everyday lives, and we're writing something that's just like it's relatable, you know. So we have to like we almost have to go out and be the person that we want to put in this song so that the person we want to hear this song can feel like they know that person, you know. Yeah, I feel like for me, it's like not trying to put like a certain timetable on a project or an idea, but allowing idea itself to dictate when it's done, not have to rush to a result or rush to put something out to please somebody or to or to get that that clapp or that ovation. But it's really just like keep it in mind as much as possible that I love the creation aspect of this, so I'm going to pour into that as much as possible. And whenever I trying to force something on a record, it ain't going like there's not they won't be a line on the paper, you know. But I feel like some of the best things are so simple and they come naturally and they just flow out of us because it's like that was meant to be for that moment, and sometimes that idea can come out instantly, sometimes it may take months. But being okay with however long that process is, and not trying to force my will or my desires or these have agreed I may have in my heart into the music, but just keeping the process as pure as possible, I'd say absolutely. And I think I think that's like, you know, and it's funny that like for me, you know, you I walk into this building and the question is, you know, how do you how do you write? How do you make music? Like what's your creative process? And I'm like, I like the I like the kind of mass scientists like I like to just you know, like we may make a beat in the studio together, I may make come up with an idea whatever, But when it's time to make the song, I want to be by myself. I want to be able to just like completely just free flow just thoughts, like let them let everything out and just you know, like brainstorm with it. And a lot of times, because the industry isn't such a microwave society thing now like now it's just like nah, just come down to the studio and just make a song on the spot. And I'm like, wait what you know, Like it's like I'm not doing that. If you ask the producer to do it, he's not doing that, like he you know, like they come in with like five to ten beats that they all just made. They didn't make any of these beats on the spot. Why do I got to make something on the spot? Like, you know, so like I agree exactly what you said. Man, I'm I'm sensing or I'm my intuition is feeling a little collab between you you two everybody. I don't know if you've heard any of Darren's music. Darren's humble to a fault, but he is crazy talented. I was just playing his music for some of my girlfriends, friends and Tuloom this last weekend, and anybody that I play his music too, they're just like blown away. You know, they're probably expecting something and then what they get with the creativity and trash. Let's let's let's not expect something. Another another athlete trying to wrap But yeah, man, it's uh yeah, super talented. The both of you are absolutely, I definitely you know, like I'm I'm I'm definitely in a collaborative world right now. So and and if it is fires you're saying you're making tuloom music, then yeah, we definitely got some music. His music isn't have a tuloom vibe, but I could see, I could see, I could see some tuloom tuloom vibe. Hey, wherever it's meant to go, it's meant to go. Yes, well, man, appreciate appreciate you coming on here today, man, and just being so open about your story and your journey and just sharing wisdom and experience and strength with the people. Man. It's uh, it's awesome to get them to see this side of you because they see the turn side, they see all the different records that you put out, but to see you're a human being and a great human being at that. Man, It's it's been a blessing to talk to you, brother. Man, it's been a blessing to be on the platform. I appreciate y'all both for having me on it. Yeah, man, thank you. There's nothing greater for me to sit and sit back and observe. You know, you got an athlete, NFL football player and a rapper and we're talking we're not talking really about those things. We're talking about the real stuff, mental health, you know, taking care of ourselves, protecting our energy, and that's everything to me. So thanks for showing up and being real today. I appreciate y'all. I had. I want to even I even add on the saying that uh, I had. I had a guy I was doing a session in California, like around the time when my father passed, and he was we were just kind of like, like I was telling him I just took a break from music. He was like, I just took a break for the same thing. You know, I had my girlfriend just broke up with me. So I was kind of and you know, just really depressed it in my world whatever whatever. And I was like, oh man, you know, I hope, like, you know, you kind of come out of that. He's like, What's what's going on with you? And I was like, well, you know, my father passed and I kind of just had to get away from the city. And he was like, oh wait, no, like what I'm going through has nothing on what you've got going on. And and but I told him, in that moment, I realized we're dealing with the same volume of emotions. It's just two completely different you know stories, two completely different reasons, two completely different you know backgrounds, But the thing that we're feeling is the same. What you know, what we're going through kind of buyds us and puts us all in the same box. So like I think, you know, this is this is really beneficial and helpful for me just to like, you know, kind of create that coalition and so like, yeo, whatever it is that I may have been dealing with, whatever it is that you you have been dealing with in the past, or we'll deal with in the future. Like we're not that far apart from each other, and that we all go through things and we all just you know, have our comeback stories and get back on top again. Thank you appreciate everybody joining us and listening to another episode of Comeback Stories. Hope you guys keep coming back. You know how we do comeback is in our DNA. Check us out anywhere as you download podcasts, subscribe, leave a review, and check us out on the Inflection Network on YouTube as well, and we'll catch you guys next week. Comeback Stories is a production of Inflection Network and iHeartRadio. 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